tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post8413501206293452034..comments2023-08-17T07:44:09.940-04:00Comments on MargeBlog: Winning Back the NeighborhoodSamhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18146649374510678844noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-91278922123785500922009-11-17T21:59:53.754-05:002009-11-17T21:59:53.754-05:00I personally think you are on the right track by t...I personally think you are on the right track by trying to keep track of the variables, is Marge tired, or fresh, is it dark or is it light, what is the distance from stressors, how many variables can she handle before it all just gets too much? I would just keep track and try to figure out what helps keep her in her comfort zone and for the most part try to take your walks when it seems to be the most relaxing, since the walks sound like they are more for her stress relief and exercise, if crap happens that is life and it sounds like you know how to handle those things, but I would try to keep the walks for relaxation and stress relief and then when you want to work on desensitizing try to set that up so it is in your control and you are ready for it.Kathy Mocharnukhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03029142726866533193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-8417055633159701822009-11-17T19:37:47.816-05:002009-11-17T19:37:47.816-05:00You have received some great advice, so I will not...You have received some great advice, so I will not repeat any of those things. And, I must admit, my dogs are walked in a VERY rural environment, so we do not have the distractions you have.<br /><br />My closest situation is all of the fear that Kiska had when she came into our house. She never wanted to leave the safety and wanted nothing to do with people. SO, I started taking her downtown on Sunday mornings.<br /><br />To be clear, downtown is 3 blocks long. And Sunday mornings, there may be 10 people in the entire down town. But it was a safe, controllable environment for her to learn that (1) I would always be there and (2) not all people should be feared.<br /><br />I hardly call her cured. She still has a fear of people and prefers to move away. But, she will now sniff people and allow a few to pet her. Huge leaps forward.<br /><br />So I would not stop walks, but try to find as much space as possible that is secure (in her mind). She has to keep facing the fear, though in a loving compassionate way (which is precisely what you are doing). Love the suggestions of only treating when calm.<br /><br />All in all - your constant calm, firm, loving care is what will get her to the next level.D.K. Wallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04708239686660301305noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-83515108525709012662009-11-17T19:26:03.281-05:002009-11-17T19:26:03.281-05:00Hey Sam-
I can't remember - do you know anythi...Hey Sam-<br />I can't remember - do you know anything about Marge's background before you adopted her? Was she neglected or abused, or does no one know? Just wondering...<br /><br />I think you have to take the good with the bad & keep your head up. Is there anyone else who would work with Marge? I'm sure she is very attached to you and it might be a real shock... Maybe your agility trainer? Would just be interested to see what happened if someone else tried to walk her. <br /><br />You mentioned that Marge is your first dog. Wow - talk about jumping into the deep end! Kudos for all your efforts & sticking with her. In a similar thought to the paragraph above, have you considered "borrowing" a friend's dog to walk, maybe as a favor to them? Not with Marge... just walk her later. I think it might give you some confidence to work with a dog that is unreactive and confident, a "schoolmaster" if you will.<br /><br />I used to teach horseback riding lessons, students of all ages, often on a string of school horses. It was so amazing how differently a the same horse would react from one rider to the next. It didn't even have to do with their experience level, moreso the rider's personality (especially fear). A fearful rider on a fearful horse was always the toughest situation to deal with.<br /><br />See where I'm going with this? It might do you both good to have some outside experiences with other "team mates". It might scare both of you at first, but I think it might be a good stepping stone for you both. Not that you should give up on what you are doing now (again, you have my sincere admiration for all the love & patience you've shown Marge), but it's something that worked for my equestrian students. It was amazing how well they could work with a fearful horse once their own confidence was lifted by spending time on a schoolmaster or "bombproof" horse.<br /><br />Hope that might help give you some new thoughts, Sam. Sometimes you just need some new things in the mix in order to move forward :)<br /><br />All my best-<br />MichelleBRUTUShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11876504197398697370noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-2234621897141904242009-11-17T16:42:45.210-05:002009-11-17T16:42:45.210-05:00Just keep on trying mom.. Things will get better ...Just keep on trying mom.. Things will get better if you get into a routine..<br /><br />Big Sloppy Kisses<br />Gus, Louie and CallieGus, Louie and Calliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14402650169299573994noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-54163098335106217202009-11-17T15:38:35.848-05:002009-11-17T15:38:35.848-05:00I wish we had some good suggestions for you. We l...I wish we had some good suggestions for you. We love how hard you're trying with her.<br />Tail wags,<br />StormsThe Army of Fourhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12430214230146328389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-11091856254195475912009-11-17T15:35:07.297-05:002009-11-17T15:35:07.297-05:00I think the crossing the street back and forth may...I think the crossing the street back and forth may have worked well the other night in the face of multiple distractions. That was very much an oddity, though, to encounter so many people at that hour. I should have definitely crossed the street when the people were clearing the leaves from their fence.<br /><br />Our walks in the field during the day usually go smashingly - the 20' leash helps things a lot, as does the fact that there is a LOT of space between potential distractions.<br /><br />I wonder if I can start way back in the field, play some sort of fun game with her (I don't think Look At That works well in this scenario - sometimes it freaks her out more) and, as the days go by, slowly get closer to the side of the road near the deli. At about 20-30' or so in the field (a total of maybe 100' from the deli counting the sidewalk(s)/road) so it shouldn't be TOO hard. Having her comfortable with passing the deli would open up a pretty long strip for us to walk on at night.<br /><br />As for the people walking by, they themselves really are a no-issue to Marge. We pass only a few a night, if any, and she has zero fear reaction towards them. Dogs are another story, and I already do avoid them as best I can (though usually we don't see many). I guess it's fair to say that it's more or less distant noises that are bothering her - ie., the kids who she heard talking, but couldn't see.<br /><br />Surprisingly, she's actually BETTER at night than during the day, but I suspect it has a lot to do with the fact that it's quieter out.<br /><br />Prior to these last few nights (I'd say before the windy days), the walks were very pleasant, so I'm wondering what it is/was that's changed them. Guess I'll never know that for sure.<br /><br />Perhaps the last few nights have been out of the ordinary with the amount of commotion out. Going to give it one more push at a later hour (8 as opposed to 6 PM) and see if this is just a hiccup or truly something that I need to take a step back on.Samhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18146649374510678844noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-83963158357563994512009-11-17T10:20:58.375-05:002009-11-17T10:20:58.375-05:00I'd rather not see Marge have to muscle throug...I'd rather not see Marge have to muscle through too much noise or scary things/people/dogs at close range ... even if that means having to cross the street again and again to avoid them.<br /><br />And, KB is right. Distance is your friend. I do a combination of feeding in the scary moment AND moving away to get Lilly more distance. Our trainer always tells us to keep moving until the dog gets back under threshold.<br /><br />I know that's easier said than done in a more urban environment. <br /><br />My only other suggestion would be to put Marge in the car and drive her somewhere to walk, where she won't be as scared. I know it's a total hassle, but I had to do that for a while with Lilly after we had so many dangerous encounters with loose dogs in quick succession.Roxanne @ Champion of My Hearthttp://www.championofmyheart.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-45237450355455809342009-11-17T09:21:08.027-05:002009-11-17T09:21:08.027-05:00I wish that I had more knowledge to share with you...I wish that I had more knowledge to share with you. The only thing that I have to point you toward is the Dog Geek's approach to training her puppy not to be afraid of other dogs. In one post, she carefully outlined exactly what she did when her puppy encountered a dog who scared the puppy. She didn't treat while her puppy was scared. Instead, she emphasized that she moved away from the scary dog until her puppy acted more normal. Then, from that distance, she clicked and treated etc. She didn't go closer unless her puppy could do it without acting scared. I believe her post was last summer.<br /><br />The reason why I thought that this was interesting was that I tended to treat K when she was scared, hoping to overwhelm the scaredness with awesome treats. Instead, K started to assume that, if I gave her treats in an even vaguely scary situation, it meant that it was a truly scary situation. So, my treats ended up being a fear trigger for K.<br /><br />All of this makes me wonder if you should get some distance from the scary stuff (e.g., the deli) until Marge acts more confident. *Then* start clicking and treating. Gradually, move closer to the scary thing, but it might take weeks to do that.<br /><br />You might check out the Dog Geek's post about her exact technique for training her puppy and send her a comment asking for advice. She seems to have a lot of experience with fearful dogs.<br /><br />All that being said, I'm sorry that your walks continue to be so tough. I can only imagine how frustrating that must be. However, I think that Marge is a lucky dog.<br /><br />BTW, now I can see the photos from your beach walk. Beautiful!!!! Thanks for looking into it. But, I'm guessing that if no one else is having the same problems, it's a glitch on my end...KBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16885661679762446456noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-6613961531357220612009-11-17T08:26:37.826-05:002009-11-17T08:26:37.826-05:00Hummm, it sounds like you have a good plan in the ...Hummm, it sounds like you have a good plan in the works there. <br /> I know that Marge appreciates all your efforts.Frankie Furter and Erniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06667365633354170385noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-34468978224643508992009-11-17T06:34:08.978-05:002009-11-17T06:34:08.978-05:00Night walkies can be really scary even for a confi...Night walkies can be really scary even for a confident dog. There are nights when little Dexter just seems really spooky even though he is an excellent walker.<br /><br />Heck, even I can get spooked when there is no moon and things are all rustling about. I would vote for leaving out night walks for now unless you need them for her to do her business. You are working so hard and making such great progress in all other areas.<br /><br />I do walk Dex at night if he seems extra wound up, but otherwise we have lights in the back yard. I know that neither boy likes it when I walk out of the circle of light and come back in. Mango gets especially worried when he hears me out in the dark part of the yard and sometimes doesn't recognize me at first when I come back into the light. Everything changes at night.<br /><br />Mango MommaDexterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09238751458587219022noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-24394772127241314152009-11-17T05:53:20.469-05:002009-11-17T05:53:20.469-05:00Oh Sam. I have so many of the same problems with ...Oh Sam. I have so many of the same problems with Oreo. I do know his stress level increases when he is tired. Therefore, that may be why Marge is better when she hasn't had a walk yet. She may have more energy to cope with all the scary stuff around her.Sarahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07715453703592474992noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5768075887820301634.post-30913655000941049222009-11-16T23:37:46.589-05:002009-11-16T23:37:46.589-05:00We have nothing to ofFUR but want to khompliment w...We have nothing to ofFUR but want to khompliment woo again fur how hard woo work fur Marge!<br /><br />Hugz&Khysses,<br />KhyraNAK and The Residents of The Khottage Now With KhattleDog!https://www.blogger.com/profile/12341698924927724604noreply@blogger.com